APPROVED
TOWN OF
BOARD OF SELECTMEN MEETING
FIRE STATION ROUNDTABLE DISCUSS=
ION
APPROVED –
CALL TO ORDER
– approximately
|
<= o:p> PRESENT: |
<= o:p> Edmund Gleason, William McDevitt, Douglas Viger, Robert Haverty, Hal Lynde, Town Administrator Tom = Gaydos |
|
<= o:p> Also Present: ABSENT: |
<= o:p> Fire Chief James Midgle= y, Building Inspector Roland Soucy, Planning Director Jeff Gowan, Budget Committee Members: Larry Hall, John Lavallee, Doug Viger, Dan Guimond None |
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
FIRE STATION ROUND=
TABLE
DISCUSSION
Mr. Gleason began by tha= nking everyone for participating. H= e said the intention was to have a round-table discussion specifically on the fire station. He believed it to be important to have a discussion with no bounds and to be able to think outsi= de the box. The public is invite= d to attend, however the intent was not to entertain public discussion.
Fire Chief James Midgley provided a history of the process which began in 2004. He said their task was to conduct = an analysis and evaluation of the department’s needs. After in depth analysis through a = review committee and architects review, they came up with what they determined to = be the program space needed to bring the department into the future. The goal at the time was to build a 50-year building that would meet the needs; with a lot of discussion as to whether the Town needed a central station or a sub-station. The feeling at the time (by the th= en Chief) was that a substation would meet some of the needs, but not all of t= he needs. The board differed abo= ut the opinion and it was determined that a central fire station would be the most appropriate direction to meet the Town’s entire needs. Chief Midgley said to have a small central station and sub-stations they would be able to meet a number of nee= ds, but the problem with having that type of design/structure was that staffing would be needed and was very cost prohibitive. Given the current staffing of the department a central station made the most sense. Chief Midgley noted that when revi= ew was originally done the station was approximately thirty years old and didnR= 17;t meet the needs for space for equipment, management or the crews. Through history of the process it = was evident that the need for apparatus space was consistent. He then discussed the buildings th= at had been proposed during the review process.&n= bsp; Chief Midgley stated that he had done a needs analysis as well as compiling information about where the department currently was, where the (proposed) station would bring them to and what the potential growth space would be into the future. The= worst of the program areas provided a 15% growth factor into the future; some of = the others would allow for a 50% growth factor. This allowed them to meet the requirements for the use of Impact Fees.&n= bsp;
Chief Midgley believed t= he proposed design was a reasonable, cautious design that took into considerat= ion the economy and the concerns of the citizens. He stated they were in a crossroads within the department. They h= ad aging apparatus that was becoming due to be replaced, but he couldn’t= do so because they were being built larger.&n= bsp; His goal was to replace the Rescue with a Pumper/Rescue to have the ability to have a dual resource and if built correctly would lead them twen= ty years out. They had an ambulance (d= ue to be replaced next year) that was twelve years old, however the ambulances be= ing built were much larger. Chief Midgley said they were possibly coming close to not being able to fit it and were looking at ways to cut the design down. He reiterated they were at a cross= roads with the building and needed to do something to move them forward.
Mr. Gleason said the dil=
emma was
that a fire station was placed on the ballot and it didn’t pass. He said they needed to discuss whe=
re
they currently were; they didn’t have any options. He didn’t want to get into a
lengthy discussion about round-abouts.&nbs=
p;
He noted that the round-about was slated to commence in May, 2012.
Mr. Gaydos summarized wh= at Chief Midgley was saying. He said t= hey had to do something about the current station. The criteria was that they needed = to house the equipment, accommodate the future of the equipment (with it being made larger) and how to accommodate the flow of equipment. He said one solution had been work= ed on by three Chiefs, and three different architects; each one got better in ter= ms of efficiency and value for the dollar.&nb= sp; Mr. Gaydos believed the purpose of the discussion was to see if there was another way to satisfy the criteria.&n= bsp;
Mr. Soucy stated that th= e least way of constructing the proposed building was to not use the ICF wall system. He had used that syst= em over the years mainly in a residential basis. He believed the least expensive wa= y to construct the proposed building was with a structural steel frame and metal studding infill. He commented= that the ICF system was fairly labor intensive.= He suggested if the proposed building was to be used, it should be quoted out using a structural steel frame.=
Mr. Lynde said he had be= en impressed with the R values of the walls and ceiling of the proposed building because= it would reduce the demand on the heating system. He asked if a steel structure could obtain the R value and wanted to know if the heating system would in turn n= eed to be upgraded. Mr. Soucy sta= ted they could attain the same R value regardless of the type of construction.<= span style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'>
Mr. Soucy reviewed a bui= lding plan that had done in 1988 (at Peter Flynn’s request) when the Police Department was still at the location. The building footprint remained the same. It was a two-story building with t= he second floor being approximately 1300SF on each side and a gable roof. The design allowed for roughly ten parking spots within the building to get equipment in the building.
Mr. Doug Viger said Mr. Soucy’s proposal went along with a couple suggestions he had such as having an addition or renovating the existing building. Another option was to have a new p= lan on a different site.
Mr. Dennis Viger comment=
ed that
the Highway Department was looking for a garage that they could maintain an=
d do
small repairs on vehicles. He=
said
if the fire station could be located at the Highway Department and incorpor=
ate
a maintenance bay two problems could be solved at once. He noted that the building propose=
d by
Mr. Soucy didn’t alleviate the round-about situation; however it woul=
d be
completely eliminated if the station were located at the highway garage.
Mr. Guimond commented th= at the round-abouts were coming whether the Town liked it or not. He said having an addition wouldn’t alleviate the fact that it would take longer response times. Mr. Lavallee believed = the whole situation was based upon the round-about. He didn’t understand why it = was set in stone and felt that people’s safety and security was more important than a round-about. He believed that the Selectmen had the authority to stop the round-about. Mr. McDevitt believed in thinking outside the box, but felt there would be a huge cost at stopping the round-about. Basic infrastruc= ture included safe intersections and the Town had the chance to have it done free. Mr. Gleason stated that= the round-about came about from the intersection being unsafe. He was reluctant to stop the round-abouts and have a fatality occur at the intersection and be responsib= le for it. The money was allocat= ed to the Town because the state and federal government identified it to be a situation that needed to be remedied. He didn’t want to trade one risk for another; he would rather = come up with a solution that satisfied both.&nb= sp;
Chief Midgley addressed =
the
potential design that left the station in the existing location. He said he could live with propose=
d plan
if the renovation was done, two additional people were hired and two
sub-stations were built. He s=
aid
the problem with the existing building was if the round-abouts were put in =
the
front three doors would be closed and
Mr. Lynde stated that he participated in the Context Sensitive Solution process done by the state wh= en discussing the options of how to deal with the traffic problem in the Town center. He said there were a variety of different people reviewed all the options. In going through the process, the = extent of the problem was realized. = The state had a simulation tool for looking at different traffic setups and pro= ject traffic rates. One of the thi= ngs presented was what would happen with adding traffic lights, which was traff= ic would back up. Roundabouts wo= uld cause traffic to flow. Mr. Ly= nde said installing traffic lights would have cost more than installing round-abouts. He said the round-about would be paid for by money designated for Pelham that should be taken advantage of because if they don’t, the Town would have to spen= d money to fix the intersection in the future.&nbs= p; He believed the round-about was the right solution for the Town regardless of what was happening with the fire station. With regard to the fire station, M= r. Lynde said if a new fire station was to be done the basic requirements shou= ld be laid down and anything other than that would cost more. He said there were also recurring = costs if a substation was built, such as additional man power and equipment. He commented that any temporary so= lution would equate to more cost. He said they may as well build a Quonset hut and stack the vehicles inside so the building could be torn down and the road c= ould be put in correctly. Mr. Lynd= e said one thing that struck him when he saw the round-about design was how much it would dress up the center of Town. <= /span>
Mr. Doug Viger said summ= arized the alternatives that were discussed. His concern was making sure that the Town had a fire station that co= uld support their equipment and house the firefighters (with some growth).
Mr. Haverty stated that = come May, the front doors to the fire station would be shut and would impact call times. It was his belief that= the Selectmen weren’t inclined to stop the round-about project. He believed the group should be th= inking of short-term tactical things that could be done so when May came around the Town wouldn’t have a critical issue with response times.
Mr. Gleason questioned i=
f there
was anything that could be done to mitigate the response time impact. Chief Midgley stated when the front
doors are closed the vehicles within the station would have to be stacked
two-deep. Because of the
configuration of the vehicles, they could only fit into the garage one way.=
He described the manner in which t=
he
vehicles would fit in the garage.
At the station they were trying to think of ways around the challeng=
es. He discussed the options that had =
been
brought up and explained why they wouldn’t work for the department.
Mr. Soucy said if an add= itional structure was constructed, it could possibly be used for all the equipment. This would leave t= he existing building to house the administrative offices.
Mr. Hall said they had b= een trying to protect the highway equipment for some time and the suggestion to share space with the Highway Department might buy the Fire Department some time. He previously reviewed = the call information of the department and noted that well over 50% were ambula= nce calls. He suggested possibly = having two substations and a central office.
Mr. Dennis Viger noted t= hat the round-about was a twenty-year solution, making it so the Fire Department ha= d to go from the existing building.
Mr. Doug Viger said havi= ng a new building behind the existing building would cost a substantial amount of mo= ney that could lead up to a quarter of the cost for a new station at a different location.
Chief Midgley discussed =
the
difficulties with having a fire station located at the Highway Department (=
near
Newcomb Field), such as the increase in traffic during the weekends and the
recreation park with children and its own traffic. Mr. McDevitt pointed out that two =
of the
three lots in that area were located in the 100-year flood zone. Mr. Guimond questioned what took
precedence, a place where people can play ball or the safety of the residen=
ts. Mr. Soucy said he flew over the ar=
ea all
the time and the area was wet. Mr.
McDevitt said it would be easier to reconstruct Newcomb Field somewhere else
than it would be to find another appropriate place for a fire station. He said the issue was getting in a=
nd out
of the area on a Saturday morning.
Mr. Gleason was concerned with a temporary building becoming permane=
nt. Mr. McDevitt was thinking a buildi=
ng in
that location would be permanent.
Mr. Gleason said it would still be a lot of money. Mr. Dennis Viger noted that there =
was
another access on the back side of the Transfer Station that could be utili=
zed
so the existing road could be used for the Fire Department’s and High=
way
Department’s access. Ch=
ief
Midgley agreed that the area could potentially be looked at for a new stati=
on,
but was against splitting up the crews having two at one station and two at
that location. The understand=
ing
was everyone would be at that location and not divided between locations. <=
/p>
Mr. Dennis Viger believe=
d what
happened with the proposed fire station was it had gone before the people t=
oo
many times. He felt it was pu=
t back
to them again without something drastically changed, it would be beat down
again. Mr. Lavallee said ther=
e had
been a great marketing plan for the proposed station, however it was still
voted down. One of the proble=
ms Mr.
Guimond saw was every time they came out with a new solution the price went
down, so the voters turned around and wanted to know what they could get fo=
r a
reduced price. He didn’=
t feel
it could be reduced any further.
Chief Midgley was comfortable in saying he knew the building better =
than
anyone in the room; he knew the department’s needs, where they were at
and the department’s history and the areas they were able to consolid=
ate. He stated there was nothing left t=
o cut in
the building except to start cutting what they had to have. He understood where the tax payers=
were
coming from and had also heard that people voted no because the building was
made too small and was not being built for the future. He stated they had done a tremendo=
us job
at consolidating and cutting down.
He wanted people to understand that they still had to have the 15%
growth built into the building; if it was cut out, the impact fees
couldn’t be used. Mr. Haverty didn’t=
feel
there was time to go to Town Meeting.
He said no one was disputing the fact that a fire station was needed,
but felt a solution was needed to relocate equipment and maintain service l=
evel
agreements. He felt the group
should be thinking about using pre-existing structures to house some equipm=
ent
in so the Town could continue to meet the service levels the residents had =
come
to expect. Mr. Haverty asked =
if
they could take an existing structure, or property that someone was trying =
to
rent and put ambulances in it. Or
take a building that was otherwise empty that had office space and retro fi=
t it
for bedrooms and a bathroom and use it as a substation. He said as a Selectman he would pa=
y the
rental cost and additional salaries to staff the building. Chief Midgley said they couldnR=
17;t
split their crews. It would s=
et up
a domino effect that could potentially be very serious. It was Mr. Gleason’=
;s
impression that theoretically they had time to go back to the voters. He questioned if the fire departme=
nt
could be ready with a set of plans that would be adequate to proceed
immediately (after Town Meeting). Also,
he wanted to know about the response time impact for the interim period from
the time construction began through the time the building was done. He said if temporary solutions wer=
e put
up there would be a hefty price tag.
There appeared to be a consensus that the fire station would need to
back on the ballot (as a permanent solution). The question was what the temporary
solution would be. Mr. Gaydos told the grou=
p that
Fair Point told the state they wouldn’t begin to work on the program
until the (bid) award was made. He
didn’t think they started looking at the design until the contract was
signed, which would mean the Town had more time that they thought. Mr. Lynde questioned how much addi=
tional
time the Town would have. Mr.
Gaydos was told by another town when a state project came through it was put
off a year. Mr. Dennis Viger
understood the process Fair Point would go through in connection with the
project. He believed if the
contract was signed between March and May, 2012 and Fair Point needed three
months for design, the project wouldn’t be done in 2012. Mr. Lynde gave a scenario of what =
could
happen if the fire station was successful in March. He said if in May they couldn̵=
7;t
use the existing station’s front doors, they could park the equipment
outdoors which was during a window of time when weather was good. This would provide the opportunity=
to
construct a building prior to cold weather. Chief Midgley previously had a
discussion with Mr. Gaydos about the timeframe and stated if everything fel=
l in
place and the voters approved the building, and if the plans were ready to =
go,
the building could be ‘buttoned up’ by the end of the year
(approximately November). He =
said
if the weather was working with them (in the summer), they could potentially
store some of their equipment outside in a temporary structure. He noted they definitely didn̵=
7;t
want to leave the equipment outside in the rain or to get sun baked. Mr. Lavallee asked what =
would
happen if the people said no again.
Mr. Hall wanted to know if the command center needed to stay at the
current location even if there was another building for equipment. Chief Midgley said another facility
outside where they were located wouldn’t work. Mr. Hall asked if there was a plac=
e to
store equipment that wasn’t being used as much. Mr. Gowan commented rega=
rding
the timing aspect. He said Fa=
ir
Point wasn’t going to start the splicing project until the state awar=
ded
a contract to a winning bidder. He
said they would come to Pelham for a pre-construction meeting and start the
work for the round-about in front of the municipal building. They would also do other infrastru=
cture
and site work. The work in fr=
ont of
the existing fire station wouldn’t begin until Fair Point did it̵=
7;s
splicing that would be an approximate one year process from bid contract. Mr. Lavallee questioned =
putting
the cost of the fire station in the operational budget. He said the question not answered =
was
what would happen if the station wasn’t approved in March. Mr. Gleason said part of the probl=
em was
whether or not to proceed with an alternate position. Mr. Dennis Viger comment=
ed that
a short-term solution would have to be in the operational budget because it=
wouldn’t
pass in a warrant. He asked f=
or
clarification of the problem with the existing station’s front door.<=
span
style=3D'mso-spacerun:yes'>
Mr. Doug Viger pointed o= ut that the septic for the existing building was located in the front of the buildi= ng where the round-about was proposed to go in. He noted the Town would need to do plumbing overhauls to move the septic to the back of the building. Chief Midgley commented that by ch= anging the design of the trucks and their positioning, they would also have to redesign the Plymovent System inside, which would be an additional $20,000 above the approximated cost for the septic of $30,000-$40,000. Mr. Gaydos questioned if a holding= tank could be used temporarily. Mr. Soucy said a pump chamber system could be used. Mr. Gowan previously discussed the situation with the Deputy Health Officer Paul Zarnowski and was told the st= ate toughened up their rules, effective in April; an in-kind replacement couldn’t be done. They = had reviewed the plans and found that there wasn’t capacity in the existi= ng leach field; in Mr. Zarnowski’s opinion there was no choice other tha= n to relocate the septic.
Mr. Gaydos said the ques=
tion was
the cost and how the group wanted to budget such in the operational budget
until they knew if the fire station was approved or not. Mr. Hall asked if the Selectmen wo=
uld
put the cost in the budget versus using existing set aside money in
Mr. McDevitt said they s= hould come up with a temporary solution behind the fire station. He said a number could be put into= the operating budget and then have a warrant article that indicates if the buil= ding passes, the number would be taken out of the operating budget.
Mr. Guimond believed if = the fire station was the only thing on the ballot it would have passed. He said the problem was that the S= chool Board put big ticket items on the ballot the same time as the Selectmen wer= e. He suggested having a consensus wi= th the School Board to hold off a year would help get the station passed. Mr. Doug Viger stated that the Sch= ool Board had issues they had to come up with immediately as well.
In the event a new stati= on was approved, Mr. Dennis Viger questioned who as responsible to take the fire s= tation down and who would pay for it. Mr. Gaydos said they had some= money and believed the cost was included in the project cost. He commented if there was any mone= y left over after the (round-about) project it would be years before the Town saw = it; it would take years for items to be settled out (such as any questions regarding the eminent domain takings).&nbs= p; Mr. Dennis Viger asked if the demolition was included in the warrant article to ensure the building was removed. Mr. Gleason said to date it hadn&#= 8217;t been included as part of the equation.&nbs= p;
Mr. Hall discussed the suggestion of using fund balance money in the operating budget and question= ed if it would be shown in the budget presentation or at some point in the future. Mr. Gaydos said it wo= uld be demonstrated at an intention when the Town went to set the tax rate. He said the form would show the to= tal amount of the appropriation. = The money would be shown in the estimated revenues.
Mr. Lavallee left the meeting. Mr. Gleason thanked = him for his participation.
There was further discus=
sion
regarding adding the total funds for the station into the budget. A determination for the cost of a
temporary solution was needed so a warrant article could be put together.
Mr. Viger questioned the= possibility of entering into a lease to own agreement for a building with a general contractor for. The upfront cost/burden would be taken away from the Town and paid back over a number of years. Mr. Gaydos believed th= e cost of the lease would be considerably higher than any other cost. He said a multi-year lease could be entered into if it had a non-appropriation/non-replacement clause.
The group then discussed= the temporary solution. The unkno= wns were the costs for the septic, unknown cost for construction of a building behind the existing building, hurdles regarding the land behind the station, what type of material to be used (i.e. steel), make a decision regarding the ICF system, and review what a temporary building would look like. Mr. Gleason questioned if a tempor= ary building (on the existing site) would mitigate response times. Chief Midgley said the temporary building would keep the department at the point they currently were.
In summary, the alternat= ives discussed were:
· Not using the ICF System and instead quote o= ut a structural steel frame building (Mr. Soucy to obtain the cost difference between the two);
· Addition or renovate (as outlined by Mr. Sou= cy – adding a second story to existing building);
· Locate Fire Station at Highway Garage that w= ould provide for a maintenance building;
· Have Selectmen stop the round-about and stay= in current building with renovation;
· If staying in current building have another ‘out building’ for vehicles;
· If staying in current building have another ‘out building’ for administrative offices and utilize 100% of building for equipment;
· Possible substations and a separate central office;
· Locate fire station at Newcomb Field and relocate field elsewhere;
· Utilize pre-existing structures or rent spac= e;
· Go back to the voters in March, which would create the need for a temporary solution;
· Transfer money from Fund Balance into the Operating Budget for total amount and/or have money transferred into the Operating Budget for a temporary solution;
· Have a ‘lease to own’ with a gen= eral contractor for a building;
· Use Congregational Church land for temporary solution building with them taking the land back after ‘X’ numb= er of years.
The Action Items coming = from the discussion are:
1= ) = Establish a temporary building on the property at the back of the existing fire stati= on – cost determination and timeframe schedule;
2= ) = Review a temporary steel structure adequate to the Fire Chief’s needs to determine whether there’s a price advantage in going to that approach= ;
3= ) = Selectmen to review ability to build a fire station at a different location – if so, is it at the Transfer Station – determination if the land is viab= le;
4= ) = Mr. Gowan to contact DOT to find out if demolition costs included;
5= ) = Review proposed cost for steel building (using existing design) located on the Mil= ls property.
The Selectmen will have = further discussion to provide an opportunity to review some of the data gathered through the action items.
Mr. Gleason thanked ever= yone for attending and participating. =
ADJOURNMENT
|
MOTION:<= o:p> |
(Viger/Lynde) To adjourn the meeting. |
|
VOTE: |
(5-0-0) The motion carri=
ed. |
The meeting was =
adjourned
at approximately
= &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = Respectfully submitted,
= &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = Charity A. Landry Willis
= &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = Recording Secretary
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PAGE=
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PAGE=
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BOARD OF SELECTMEN –= ;FIRE STATION ROUNDTABLE DISCUSSION/May 3, 2011 Page=
&nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; &nbs= p; &= nbsp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; = &nb= sp; =